Chaos Pub

[Nude For Satan]

Quote:Something to at least minimize the "LAME" tactics might be useful in keeping new players, and regulars

Agree. But the question is: what?

Quote:With current spawn bty, 'neg killing' isnt as much of an issue. But now you have things such as ppl employing mine reps (sometimes from cloakers, and even from turrets such as Gadianthon), vulching and running away, purchasing bonus boosters/reps/etc, etc .........

- This is, as you allude to later, "a part of the game". What's a tougher issue for us these days is that, with lower population, these tactics are safer to perpetrate, and potentially more devastating to new player retention. Other elements retain status quo, eg there are less targets for mine repping, and less melee/confusion in which to take advantage of someone's compromised attention, but on the other hand someone flying half the map to get back to a battle that just been killed out of, can still be totally unsuspecting.

- Vulching is a tough call, in an arena that is based on attack everything, its almost a misnomer. Specifically targetting weakened ships and scarpering from anyone at 1699 is of course lame.

- Lobbing, radar bombing, linebombing are generally lame. IMO I consider it lame if its all someone does. If on the other hand they've been fighting honourable for some time, get separated from the duel, then decide to head back to the centre to find targets, then there's no reason why they shouldn't send in a few bombs as a vanguard.

- Purchasing Bonuses (especially boosters, IMO), are of course an angering issue. you can successfully duel every special off an opponent only to have them triple burst you to end your five minutes hard work in a spray of ouch. Bonusing DOES change the playing field, turn the tables. it just DOES.



Overall, these things are totally find for a *chaotic* melee environment. The issues aren't with the use of these tactics as they stand. Nothing is wrong with them. If you were on the Somme I doubt you'd concern yourself too much with "nah that'd be pretty lame". The issues are with using them in an arena that was built for higher populations, where the advantage shifts more towards these lamers. In a high population environment, a chain of blue bombs suddenly hitting a three-frequency duel and exploding everything was as hilarious as it was angering. These days its far less amusing because there's *nothing* out there on the fringes to hold the lobber accountable. They can do it at will with their only fear being of their eyes bleeding from the qq.



So I agree with you, but reserve my opinion to note that its all about the changing environment.



Of course, you're not just presenting an account, you're asking, what can be done? Me too. Well, any major change should be considered separately as there could be a lot of pros and cons that people might want to put forward. One thread each makes more sense to me. There's one adjustment already on the table that i'd just been shouting at people about this morning, so I'll start a new thread for that shortly.

Quote:Im not really a big fan of turrets to begin with. And its even worse now when the zone is so small. Sometimes when theres a temporary increase in numbers, you can end up with a 4-person turret, and then when ppl start leaving the freq size is adjusted, but the turret could still have 4 ppl on it till they leave. When i see that situation, i cant even be bothered to unspec.

Yes the general advantage turrets have is greater now that the population is lower. It can be pretty silly to turret when there's only two other players in the arena. The issue you mention, of turrets sticking around as people leave and remaining as a 4-person stack against lowering pop with freq size=2 can be a pretty lame personal choice of the turretters.

BUT, what is your suggestion? This has been kicked around many times (I'm just reporting what I've heard, I haven't been in Chaos a long time so I'm not the best source of info) and the different ideas to attend this problem come with issues of their own.

- If you were to forcible split a 4 person freq when the freq size goes down to max, 1. Which one of those players gets changed? How would you elect which player? 2. How can we differentiate between a turret and a general freq? Some poor bastard has worked hard for 2000bty alone, gets joined by others, then freq size goes down and he gets changed off his freq, potentially having his bty reset or spawning on a stack of mines? 3. When do you do this? It would be bot driven, so they could be *about to die* when the bot suddenly respawns them safely on another freq. 4. How do you manage freqent freq size changes? The freq size might JUST go up, you join a freq, the freq size goes down again 2 minutes later (or less!) and you're thrown out?

- Maybe if a player got *killed*, and their freq size was out of synch, that player might lose their spot on the freq? I remember asking this once and there was a reason why it wasn't as simple as it sounded.

- If a player entered safe (or whole turret did, of course), then they might have their freqs changed. Back to the earlier one, who gets changed? Where do they spawn? etc etc Also, what if they were generally afk to go for a leak, then they come back and looks like they've been brickwarped out of safe.



The concepts are there, but this would need a lot more work. Can you see how its just not that simple?

Quote:I like having the multiple flags in the zone too. It adds extra goals and a way to gain points.

I also like those few times when the MULTIPLE flags gave you a level-up for guns ONLY . A single flag with level-up wouldnt be bad if it didnt end up on a turret. But multiple flags with level-up is a big red target that will be chased by groups of people (so it can still be handled), the flagger has the ability to hold them off with l4 guns, AND even a turret with l4 guns can still be gunned down by chasers with l4 guns . And a turret isnt going to last HOURS at a time even if they run around the periphery because where they once wouldve come CLOSE to dying but repel and rocket away, now they may not get away

Flag Game thread <img src='http://www.subspace.co/public/style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blum.gif' class='bbc_emoticon' alt=':p' />

Quote:Too many times, we hear the reason why something isnt being changed is "its always been part of the game". Well, if noones playing anyway, then whats the point ? Maybe its time to think about a change that brings new balance

Whether changes are made, or are not made, there will be parties that are fer and parties that are agin it. I hear your frustration, but we need to work out not just that "something needs to be done", but also what that something is.



Watch for new threads as I'll try to open up discussion/debate/shitfight about a few of the points you've raised.



btw NuB is clearly trolling, I presume you picked that?